spies4Zander (11:47:25 PM): Hey Singe
spies4Singe (11:47:35 PM): Hey Zander how's it goin?
spies4Zander (11:47:44 PM): Pretty good but I missed a lot today apparently
spies4Singe (11:47:53 PM): I missed the fake imprisonment
spies4Singe (11:48:20 PM): I have good news for you regardless of your alignment--people perceive you as rational and fair
spies4Zander (11:48:23 PM): Haha, as did I... I have to say I'm a bit angry - we basically just lost our most helpful citizen, and to a fake imprisonment as well... Not very cool
spies4Zander (11:48:45 PM): I guess I can live with rational and fair :-P. From what I've heard, you are basically in the same boat.
spies4Singe (11:48:50 PM): Well, it was a good gut check, cause in my Confessional I said she was the only person I trusted close to completely, lol
spies4Zander (11:49:12 PM): She pushed way too hard for me to suspect her as a spy. I don't think spies would ever do that
spies4Singe (11:49:21 PM): I guess she just gave off a completely down-to-earth attitude
spies4Singe (11:49:34 PM): didn't really seem worried about what anyone thought
spies4Singe (11:49:44 PM): and I'd expect a spy to come across much less sincerely
spies4Zander (11:49:50 PM): And really tried to help get us motivated... That was why I liked her a lot
spies4Singe (11:50:00 PM): I was looking forward to havin her in my family
spies4Singe (11:50:08 PM): but now it makes sense why she wasn't committing
spies4Zander (11:50:15 PM): Right now I guess the thing I'm looking for most is people who seem like they're changing
spies4Singe (11:50:29 PM): Well, some people are softening their stances after taking some heat
spies4Zander (11:50:35 PM): But since I missed a lot of conversations today, all I've heard is that Abrams and Martha have been the most obvious with this
spies4Singe (11:50:39 PM): right
spies4Singe (11:50:58 PM): I actually talked to Abrams for 20 minutes today to get my own read as opposed to all this secondhand and thirdhand stuff
spies4Singe (11:51:10 PM): he sounds more frustrated than anything
spies4Zander (11:51:19 PM): I talked to Abrams as well and to be honest he confused me...
spies4Singe (11:51:28 PM): so my tentative read is that he means well but went about it too aggressively
spies4Zander (11:51:30 PM): He contradicted himself
spies4Singe (11:51:33 PM): what'd you get off him?
spies4Zander (11:51:43 PM): Do you want me to copy some of it?
spies4Singe (11:51:46 PM): sure.
spies4Zander (11:52:02 PM): Basically he told me he was either voting Lloyd or Martha, and then he said he didn't think Lloyd was a spy, and then he said he wasn't going to vote Lloyd... in the span of about 10 minutes
spies4Singe (11:52:03 PM): I'm assuming you don't want this forwarded past me.
spies4Zander (11:52:16 PM): I think the only other people I will tell are in my family
spies4Zander (11:52:26 PM): at this point I have no reason to distrust you since you have been solid with me, so I have no problem sharing info
spies4Zander (11:52:31 PM): I just hope it's not going into the wrong hands
spies4Singe (11:52:34 PM): It's a challenge to remember whose secrets to keep and what's forwardable lol
spies4Singe (11:52:49 PM): Just like dealing with girlfriends XD
spies4Zander (11:52:55 PM): hah! How true
spies4Zander (11:53:00 PM): Although I haven't had much of that as a problem :-P
spies4Singe (11:53:08 PM): well, I didnt get the sense Abrams had narrowed
spies4Singe (11:53:25 PM): as of 7 oclock east coast time
spies4Singe (11:53:30 PM): so that's interesting
spies4Singe (11:53:35 PM): he's all over the map...
spies4Zander (11:53:48 PM): Okay, here goes the convo... At least the more relevant and jointed parts...
spies4Zander (11:53:49 PM): spies4Zander (11:00:49 PM): Who are you looking towards right now? Obviously Martha...
spies4Zander (11:53:57 PM): spies4Abrams (11:00:56 PM): Martha and Lloyd.
spies4Zander (11:01:16 PM): Really? Lloyd??
spies4Abrams (11:01:23 PM): Yup.
spies4Zander (11:01:25 PM): Wow
spies4Zander (11:54:13 PM): spies4Abrams (11:01:34 PM): As I said before, pending a talk with him.
spies4Zander (11:01:43 PM): Is it just because he seems somewhat set against Martha, or...?
spies4Abrams (11:01:54 PM): No, he's had some interesting actions.
spies4Zander (11:54:23 PM): [17:55] spies4Lloyd: did you get my message ;-)
[17:56] spies4Abrams: Bout?
[17:56] spies4Lloyd: rape
[17:56] spies4Abrams: Ah, yes.
[17:56] spies4Abrams: That wasn't nic.e
spies4Singe (11:54:27 PM): zzz
spies4Singe (11:54:34 PM): lol
spies4Zander (11:54:39 PM): [17:57] spies4Lloyd: cant a girl have a little fun
[17:57] spies4Abrams: Not if it's sticking things in me.
[17:58] spies4Lloyd: I was sticking your things in me
[17:58] spies4Abrams: Erm...
[17:58] spies4Abrams: Eew?
spies4Zander (11:54:47 PM): [17:58] spies4Lloyd:
[17:59] spies4Abrams: (fail)
[17:59] spies4Lloyd: :-P
spies4Abrams (11:02:00 PM): Read that.
spies4Singe (11:54:51 PM): that's a terrible reason
spies4Zander (11:54:56 PM): spies4Zander (11:02:32 PM): Hmm... It doesn't seem that threatening to me, really. That is just his personality
spies4Zander (11:02:40 PM): He was doing it all during the kickoff chat
spies4Abrams (11:02:59 PM): Eh, but then I was told he was accusing me and Ralph of being homophobic.
spies4Abrams (11:03:07 PM): That really got me thinking.
spies4Singe (11:54:56 PM): for wanting someone out
spies4Zander (11:55:01 PM): just wait, I ask him about it soon
spies4Zander (11:55:09 PM): spies4Abrams (11:03:12 PM): He may just not like me.
spies4Abrams (11:03:27 PM): But I'm still interested in what he has to say.
spies4Zander (11:03:50 PM): True, but are you willing to vote for him just because he doesn't like you?
spies4Zander (11:04:00 PM): I think we have bigger issues on our hands than people just not liking us
spies4Zander (11:55:21 PM): spies4Abrams (11:04:02 PM): No.
spies4Abrams (11:04:08 PM): Like I said, convo pending.
spies4Zander (11:05:09 PM): Honestly, man, the only reason you've given me for suspecting Lloyd is that he doesn't like you... Is there anything else?
spies4Zander (11:05:26 PM): Have you not talked to him at all the entire game besides that, because it seems just a bit random to go after someone?
spies4Zander (11:55:31 PM): spies4Abrams (11:05:39 PM): No.
spies4Abrams (11:05:54 PM): I just... I wasn't gonna vote him.
spies4Abrams (11:06:00 PM): He's just a little off.
spies4Zander (11:06:21 PM): But Abrams, you just said that your choices were between Martha and Lloyd...
spies4Zander (11:55:40 PM): spies4Abrams (11:06:33 PM): I know.
spies4Abrams (11:06:44 PM): Those are the people I need to talk to
spies4Abrams (11:06:54 PM): I have my own agenda.
spies4Abrams (11:07:00 PM): Lloyd isn't a spy.
spies4Abrams (11:07:10 PM): But if he's spreading shit, I want that stopped.
spies4Zander (11:55:51 PM): spies4Zander (11:08:04 PM): Okay...
spies4Abrams (11:08:24 PM): Nothing.
spies4Abrams (11:08:28 PM): Sorry I brought it up.
spies4Singe (11:56:00 PM): whoa
spies4Zander (11:56:01 PM): I'm not the only one that finds that suspicious, right?
spies4Singe (11:56:06 PM): so he's looking towards Lloyds
spies4Singe (11:56:12 PM): but Lloyd's not a spy
spies4Zander (11:56:15 PM): just because Lloyd wants to have buttsex with him
spies4Zander (11:56:18 PM): it doesn't make any sense
spies4Singe (11:56:32 PM): spies4Abrams (11:07:00 PM): Lloyd isn't a spy.
spies4Singe (11:56:40 PM): That's the most troublesome line in the whole thing
spies4Singe (11:56:51 PM): How on earth does he get that read
spies4Zander (11:56:57 PM): he seems so positive, for someone who would vote for him just minutes ago
spies4Singe (11:57:00 PM): Right
spies4Zander (11:57:07 PM): I don't know, I hate, HATE throwing out accusations this early
spies4Singe (11:57:07 PM): Well, he's playing headgames
spies4Zander (11:57:10 PM): but what is his drive?
spies4Singe (11:57:16 PM): Let me share this with you:
spies4Singe (11:57:35 PM): he's playing head fakes about whether or not he has a special powerfu lrole
spies4Singe (11:57:50 PM): alternately saying he doesn't and then that he might
spies4Singe (11:58:04 PM): so it's a consistent strategy of inconsistency...
spies4Zander (11:58:10 PM): ... Annelise...
spies4Zander (11:58:26 PM): Sorry, that reminds me a lot of Anneliese from Spies 3...
spies4Zander (11:58:48 PM): But why does he feel the need to play like this so early in the game?
spies4Singe (11:59:35 PM): I suppose stirring things up is good in many ways
spies4Singe (11:59:49 PM): So long as it doesn't turn him into the sole focus if he's town
spies4Singe (12:00:05 AM): After all, wolves on his scent may come at him too aggressively
spies4Zander (12:00:11 AM): That's very true
spies4Singe (12:00:17 AM): Which is something we could use if he does as a Citizen
spies4Singe (12:00:28 AM): *dies
spies4Zander (12:00:55 AM): At the same time though, I feel like it's too early for him to have to go insane to protect himself. And why does he need to protect himself so much? I heard he was not as serious a target as earlier in the day
spies4Singe (12:01:06 AM): I'm afraid the spies are getting a good idea of who's rational and who's impressionable
spies4Zander (12:01:07 AM): Hah, why did you die?
spies4Singe (12:01:24 AM): that was a typo correction, sorry
spies4Zander (12:01:27 AM): ah
spies4Singe (12:01:38 AM): and from what I heard, he's been a target from minute 1
spies4Zander (12:01:46 AM): That's true...
spies4Singe (12:01:48 AM): when he fought with Bev then made up right after roles
spies4Zander (12:01:52 AM): Ralph instantly turned to him, as did Beverly
spies4Zander (12:01:58 AM): not to him, on him, rather
spies4Singe (12:01:59 AM): which I doubt a spy would ever do lol
spies4Zander (12:02:32 AM): If he was really, really careless, he would, but I'm leaning more towards your side on this... I have told everyone that I don't seriously suspect Abrams, even though Ralph kept trying to push for him
spies4Zander (12:03:15 AM): I just don't like that he's being troublesome so early... I think it's less strategy and more panic...
spies4Singe (12:03:23 AM): Well, if he's a spy, he's going to make himself a target of all sorts of powers should there be any in this game
spies4Singe (12:03:39 AM): If I were a spy I'd be concerned about that any try not to be the most visible person\
spies4Zander (12:03:40 AM): It's Sam, or course there are powers hah!
spies4Singe (12:04:06 AM): Have any Spies games been without? I skimmed one that had a gambler and card reader
spies4Zander (12:04:07 AM): Well, look around, there are tons of people being active but at the same time slightly antisocial or not contributing much to anyone
spies4Zander (12:04:17 AM): There's always at least two abilities
spies4Zander (12:04:44 AM): I'm just worried that Abrams, even if he's not a spy, is going to be hurtful to us rather than helpful
spies4Zander (12:04:54 AM): But it's not worth an exile vote if I don't think he's a spy
spies4Zander (12:05:50 AM): He seems out for his own gain, but I guess we'll see sooner or later if he's going to try to gain information by being wishy-washy and share it with others
spies4Singe (12:06:27 AM): Would you expect that the Spies have already laid out a plan for interaction amongst themselves?
spies4Singe (12:06:52 AM): ie: "you and i will fight, and i'll be best pals with Z and lukewarm to Q" and so on
spies4Zander (12:06:56 AM): Probably, and it would probably be a plan of a lack of interaction, or counter-intuitive interaction
spies4Zander (12:07:26 AM): for example, if Beverly and Abrams were spies, they were both very hostile to each other for a while
spies4Zander (12:07:30 AM): then Abrams apologized to Beverly
spies4Zander (12:07:37 AM): making them both seem like citizens...
spies4Zander (12:07:45 AM): I doubt this, but it could be a clever move...
spies4Singe (12:07:56 AM): if they hadn't started the spat before the roles went out i'd be much more suspicious
spies4Singe (12:08:08 AM): as it stands, i can't fathom that BOTH of them are spies
spies4Singe (12:08:16 AM): or else I imagine they'd have carried on with the row
spies4Zander (12:08:18 AM): Yes, I agree
spies4Zander (12:08:28 AM): One of them would have been wise enough to keep up appearances
spies4Singe (12:08:42 AM): they probably would have discussed it right away
spies4Singe (12:08:50 AM): and agreed to keep on keepin on
spies4Zander (12:08:51 AM): Overall I just don't think we can rule anyone out right now... And with exile coming tomorrow, it's not very comforting that the targets keep changing all the time.
spies4Singe (12:09:07 AM): well, i assume YOUR targets don't change that rapidly
spies4Singe (12:09:12 AM): nor do mine
spies4Zander (12:09:22 AM): I'm glad people think I'm "fair", but people do change abruptly so who knows...
spies4Singe (12:09:23 AM): but I do need to get to know a lot of people better in 20 hours
spies4Zander (12:09:30 AM): Yes, I agree...
spies4Singe (12:09:32 AM): well, to be honest, Z
spies4Singe (12:09:48 AM): for you to get the boot would take someone spotting a major discrepancy in your play
spies4Singe (12:10:03 AM): or perhaps displeasure with your votes... they're public, correct?
spies4Zander (12:10:06 AM): My suspicions honestly have not really changed that much. I don't trust some of the people who are not willing to initiate conversation, because it seems like they have a reason not to
spies4Zander (12:10:17 AM): Yes, if this goes according to past seasons, all votes are public...
spies4Singe (12:10:28 AM): If you hadn't noticed, I'm a first-timer
spies4Singe (12:10:43 AM): I think a few others are pretending to be and aren't, but I'm a genuine rookie
spies4Zander (12:10:52 AM): I don't really have anything to discrepancize (? hah!) so hopefully, I don't cast unnecessary suspicion against myself in 20 hours :-P
spies4Zander (12:11:24 AM): I agree, but I have no reason to hold back that I am experienced. Good luck to those trying to figure out my identity, they don't know which season(s) I've played :-P
spies4Singe (12:11:29 AM): Well, better to attract a little suspicion if it draws some dirtbags out into the open
spies4Zander (12:11:35 AM): Speak of the devil, Masaki just IMs me now
spies4Singe (12:11:38 AM): same here
spies4Zander (12:12:02 AM): True, I definitely do not want to get Imprisoned because nobody is willing to exile me. It's more honorable, but not more enjoyable
spies4Singe (12:12:23 AM): I think you'll be an asset to the Burg if you're a good guy. A major one.
spies4Zander (12:12:27 AM): But the past has proven true - trying to cast even a little suspicion on yourself can get you exiled in a moment's notice... You just always have to keep on your toes, I guess
spies4Singe (12:12:52 AM): I think if I had an investigative role I might check you out right away, just so I'd know if I had a powerful ally or not
spies4Zander (12:13:06 AM): Well I'm doing my best right now, I know it's only the first few days so obviously people can't be too willing to trust people, but I'm going to do my best to be helpful to everyone and that's all I can promise
spies4Singe (12:13:12 AM): right
spies4Singe (12:13:24 AM): people's sincerity and motives will work themselves out over time
spies4Zander (12:13:34 AM): To be honest, I would probably check someone like me out right away, as well. I haven't been the loudest person because it's not my personality anyway
spies4Singe (12:13:37 AM): I'm not looking for anyone's trust right now, in fact the opposite
spies4Zander (12:13:57 AM): And you can't go looking for trust in the first couple of weeks, or you will only bring trouble upon yourselves
spies4Zander (12:14:19 AM): Spies gobble up people too willing to make allies and spill information, you have to be careful. I've made the mistake in the past.
spies4Singe (12:14:29 AM): Really?
spies4Singe (12:14:44 AM): I guess you can tell me after the game hehe
spies4Zander (12:14:57 AM): Yes, unfortunately saying it now might incriminate myself haha
spies4Singe (12:14:59 AM): right
spies4Zander (12:15:09 AM): Just, if I have any advice at all, be careful who you tell information to
spies4Singe (12:15:31 AM): I try to hold my info somewhat tightly for a few reasons
spies4Zander (12:15:36 AM): Things like my conversation with Abrams, I don't find to be a big deal, especially to you, because I don't think it makes me a target for imprisonment unless you and Abrams are both spies
spies4Singe (12:15:42 AM): 1) Don't want to start tidal waves unfairly
spies4Zander (12:15:58 AM): but if you have a role or any really hardcore evidence, keep it to yourself unless there are confirmed citizens
spies4Singe (12:16:10 AM): 2) The fastest way to lose trust is to spread rumors wantonly
spies4Zander (12:16:24 AM): *And be wishy-washy
spies4Singe (12:16:26 AM): well, like I told Abrams, if you dont have a role and blabber that fact
spies4Singe (12:16:37 AM): it narrows the pool of people who may hAVE such a role
spies4Singe (12:16:54 AM): so hopefully he's just gaming the spies if he's a good guy
spies4Zander (12:16:58 AM): True... Some of Sam's roles are originals, also, and spies have capitalized on making up roles before as well
spies4Singe (12:17:00 AM): but it sure makes him a target...
spies4Zander (12:17:13 AM): So have citizens, in the same right
spies4Singe (12:18:04 AM): If you ever have something interesting to bounce off anyone
spies4Singe (12:18:17 AM): I know this is an empty promise, lol, but I'm your guy.
spies4Zander (12:18:51 AM): I figured as much, since I already did so
spies4Singe (12:18:57 AM): I enjoy the detail work in this game and I'll give you an honest opinion without a whole bunch of emotional fluff
spies4Zander (12:19:17 AM): To be honest, I think even if you were a spy, telling you about conversations and things wouldn't put me in much danger anyway
spies4Zander (12:19:33 AM): And it's good to have another entertainer to talk to :-P
spies4Singe (12:19:36 AM):
spies4Singe (12:19:48 AM): I'm actually headed outside to spin some fire in a moment
spies4Singe (12:19:52 AM): relaxes me
spies4Zander (12:19:58 AM): That's awesome
spies4Zander (12:20:07 AM): I've been practicing a few of my skills recently...
spies4Singe (12:20:35 AM): I've gotta say you got the best picture
spies4Zander (12:20:39 AM): I'm working on trying to enhance my channeling and stuff like that... but I doubt it would really help me here. Who knows if I would get a good read
spies4Zander (12:20:44 AM): I was so happy with how it turned out! Thanks
spies4Singe (12:20:51 AM): My ears look like they could fly me to Australia.
spies4Zander (12:20:59 AM): Hah! I hate to agree, but you're right
spies4Singe (12:21:26 AM): Nothing a little tape or magic can't fix.
spies4Singe (12:21:53 AM): I also think this'll be an entertaining game, and we'll contribute to that for certain so long as we're around.
spies4Zander (12:22:07 AM): And hopefully that will be for a long time
spies4Zander (12:22:28 AM): you just have to be careful. It's not hard for spies to spot people that are being productive or get along with people, and they're generally the first targets
spies4Singe (12:22:40 AM): By the way...
spies4Singe (12:22:46 AM): have you seen any of Bev's suspicions?
spies4Singe (12:22:57 AM): They tend to get drowned out amidst the CAPS
spies4Zander (12:22:59 AM): Not entirely. She's a bit reserved with me when it comes to suspicions, which I find surprising
spies4Singe (12:23:44 AM): That's what I intend to work on tomorrow with her.
spies4Singe (12:23:57 AM): Somewhere in the middle of a chat about bubble gum and shoes.
spies4Zander (12:24:02 AM): hah!
spies4Zander (12:24:08 AM): And possibly how cute she finds me
spies4Singe (12:24:56 AM): lol there's that lucky devil muahahaha
spies4Zander (12:25:15 AM): hmm...
spies4Zander (12:25:21 AM): This vote is twisting insanely
spies4Singe (12:25:37 AM): I don't have a sense for where it's headed yet.
spies4Zander (12:26:15 AM): Masaki is giving me a rundown right now I guess?
spies4Zander (12:26:21 AM): I don't know how informative this is going to be...
spies4Singe (12:26:52 AM): I suppose you can tell whether he's done some legwork or is just reading you lines
spies4Zander (12:29:28 AM): Basically recapping everything that has been going on
spies4Zander (12:29:52 AM): Although he mentioned people saying Abrams was too full of himself - it's funny though, since I think I was the first to say that yesterday and now everyone ran with that...
spies4Singe (12:30:02 AM): hehe
spies4Singe (12:30:08 AM): Jeremiah's worse in that regard lol
spies4Zander (12:30:48 AM): Haha, very much so.
spies4Singe (12:34:26 AM): i imagine people will be humbled rather quickly, spies or citizens
spies4Zander (12:35:14 AM): Yes, I think unless we get lucky with this exile vote (since at this point there doesn't seem to be much honest thinking going on about voting), there's going to be a lot of panic going on
spies4Singe (12:35:45 AM): i just hope there are no inactives to exile
spies4Singe (12:35:53 AM): because if there is one, they're bound to be a citizen
spies4Zander (12:36:13 AM): From what I've seen, everyone has been on at this point
spies4Singe (12:36:18 AM): that's good
spies4Zander (12:36:27 AM): And also probably a first :-P From what I recall, it is...
spies4Singe (12:36:28 AM): i think we'll find our spies amongst the busybodies
spies4Zander (12:36:33 AM): Let's just see if we keep it up
spies4Zander (12:36:53 AM): In Spies 1, almost all three spies were inactive for at least some length of time
spies4Zander (12:37:10 AM): but they lost fairly quickly because the citizens figured spies were trying to lay low
spies4Singe (12:37:35 AM): Oh, I do have a question for you
spies4Zander (12:37:40 AM): the strategy has certainly changed as the games advanced, but it seems that the past two season the spies have worked in a more disconnected fashion... Usually you'll find all of them work differently
spies4Singe (12:37:49 AM): Someone who's been more paranoid than anyone... any idea who I'm about to mention?
spies4Zander (12:38:07 AM): Hmm... I might have one but if I guess wrong I might seem stupid :-P
spies4Zander (12:38:16 AM): Ralph?
spies4Singe (12:38:21 AM): i could be wrong as well
spies4Singe (12:38:25 AM): and yeah that's him lol
spies4Zander (12:38:32 AM): yay I get 3 points hah
spies4Singe (12:38:46 AM): Any sense of whether it's genuine new-guy syndrome or something potentially concerning?
spies4Zander (12:39:51 AM): To be honest Ralph is not very good with grammar which makes me think he's both foreign and unfamiliar with many aspects of the game
spies4Singe (12:39:59 AM): ah
spies4Zander (12:40:03 AM): at the same time I think he's trying very hard, and since he's in my family I'd like to believe he's being genuine
spies4Singe (12:40:18 AM): he asked me to pledge not to vote for him the first night we all got online together
spies4Zander (12:40:22 AM): It's never something so simple though, I'll just have to keep on the lookout
spies4Zander (12:40:25 AM): He did the same to me
spies4Zander (12:40:27 AM): that concerns me a bit
spies4Singe (12:40:35 AM): i found that endearing, a lil weird but i nearly got a sincere vibe off it
spies4Zander (12:40:38 AM): And I know he is protecting Madison... But I didn't tell you that
spies4Singe (12:40:42 AM): ok
spies4Zander (12:41:42 AM): They apparently had some type of pact before identities were given... Which makes me a bit concerned, because how do they know if they should be protecting one another?
spies4Zander (12:41:54 AM): But sometimes you find that in these games.
spies4Singe (12:42:16 AM): interesting
spies4Zander (12:42:20 AM): I really like Madison but I am concerned... Right after identities were given she basically disappeared in our family chat room, and then hasn't been around much the past two days either.
spies4Zander (12:42:26 AM): She could just be busy
spies4Singe (12:42:51 AM): I haven't seen her for more than 2 mihnutes.
I don't think he fully trusts anyone, but I think I am definitely on his good side...